Posted by
CPT on Wednesday, December 27, 2006 1:56:19 PM
Dennis Prager makes a case for the Torah (5 books of the Old Testament) being the basis for the current American "culture war". The difference maker that joins religious Jews and Christians in a firm moral grounding based on the divinity ("not literalism according to Prager) and authority of God's word.
A respondent to his article calling self "TheLeftIsEvil" answered this way:
"examine the reasons why we in the Secular Right believe what we believe, including...
Individualism. We are not groupists. We don't believe men and women are inherently different; we believe individuals are inherently different. Each and every mind contains worlds of thought and experience. Groupism denies this.
Freedom. Individual cultural, political, and economic freedoms are profoundly an American creation. It isn't Biblical at all. Freedom and a theocratic state don't belong together in the same breath.
The open universe. The Bible describes a mythos, much like other world mythos, of a scripted, planned, orchestrated universe managed by God for God's own pleasure.
Secular American conservatives believe science got it right when the various sciences discovered the many, many systems of self organization in which we live, including human culture.
The open universe means we aren't puppets or actors in a play. We aren't handed our scripts by Divine power or given stage directions. The open universe means what we think, decide, and act upon are all freely chosen by us, and through which we freely experience all of the freely flowing effects.
Free minds, free markets, free societies, free universe. It all fits together so well. We reject both the statism of the Secular Left and the scriptedness of the Religious Right. We are Hayekian secular conservatives. We are Americans."
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I don't see Prager's position and the respondent's as mutually exclusive, just in disagreement as to from where these principles are derived. I see it differently.
Individualism: There is nothing to disagree with. God clearly states in the Bible our uniqueness and INDIVIDUAL value to him.
Freedom: While Judaism is predicated on "law" to honor and love God, Christianity is predicated on FREEDOM. Freedom to choose to believe or to not believe, to accept Christ's gift or not. Its the ultimate in personal responsibility and accountability. It is TOTALLY biblical and throughout. Similarly Jews are FREE (and have demonstrated it frequently) to choose to adhere to the "Law" or to not obey God. Prager makes no case and has stated his opposition to "theocracy". Theocracy and faith aren't the same and one doesn't lead to the other. The respondent doesn't seem to understand this.
The "open universe": The Bible is God's word in the belief of most Christians and Jews. It is only a "Mythos" to those who choose to ignore or not believe. That's fine. It appears that the respondent objects to the concept of an omniscient, omnipresent and omnipotent God. That's fine. Also, it is inaccurate to describe God as operating for "God's own pleasure". This is refuted frequently in the Bible. Further, it anthropomorphizes God in a way not reflective of him or his Word in the Bible.
Science: Believers know that people organize themselves in various ways. There is no singular "human culture", there are many diverse cultures. Believers understand that all cultures aren't equal in value and contribution but that some are SUPERIOR and that it is ok to make that distinction. Science didn't discover cultures, cultures pursued science. Particularly, Christian European culture kept ancient science alive and then provided the seed beds (Universities) for the rebirth of scientific exploration. Nothing in faith precludes science and nothing in science disproves or invalidates God. That is a personal choice. Many, if not most, of the scientists revered in history were faithful Christian or Jewish believers. Many are today as well.
Puppets: The "open universe" (what does that mean anyway?) doesn't "mean" anything. It is an undefined and unquantified platitudinous substitute to fill an emptiness of spirit/soul/faith as I see it. The only difference is that the "open universe" doesn't have thousands of years of study, adherence and commentary accrued to it. Most if not all Jews and Christians don't believe that we are all "puppets or actors in a play" nor do most believe that we are "handed our scripts by Divine power or given stage directions". I can't speak for Jews (except by my understanding of their history, religion and culture) but as far as Christians, in my experience, for them too it "means what we think, decide, and act upon are all freely chosen by us, and through which we freely experience all of the freely flowing effects". The exception I would take is to substitute *consequences* for "effects". I would also point out that a central premise of Christian belief is the FREEDOM of choice salvation entails.
The stereotyped, undefined *lumpengruppen* of "religious right".
The respondent refers to "the scriptedness of the Religious Right". Where is the "script"? Who wrote it? I haven't seen anyone anywhere who can give me a solid definition of who composes "the Religious Right" beyond the occasional "Jerry Falwell" and "Pat Robertson". How about a demographic here please? It certainly isn't all Christians. I assert that it isn't all (or even a large minority) of "Christian Conservatives" either. At least I've seen no proof. What are the attributes of the "Religious Right"? What are the policies of the "Religious Right"? Who does the "Religious Right" represent and how is it organized? I think that the term is a general term used whenever a person doesn't like an argument made by a person of faith or used to try to invalidate the inherent right of people of faith to participate in our political processes. In the context of the respondent, it appears, that he/she sees two types of the political right, the "secular" and the "religious". Well there is nothing wrong with that. Nor with those on the left espousing their views. A belief system, religious or not, doesn't preclude anyone from political speech or activism. Nor does a lack of any particular belief (which I've never seen). People's political views are driven by their economic situation and, even more so, by their core system of values, ethics and morals. It is very clear where that system comes from for people of faith. What isn't nearly as clear is where that system comes from in "secular" or "atheist" or "humanist" types of people. That isn't a value judgment, its an observation that one group (People of Faith) have clear moral underpinnings from which they derive their system or values, ethics and morals. For the other groups/types listed there is no such clarity.
That is the thrust of Prager's article as I see it. He is simply pointing out that people of faith, who are socially conservative, predicate much of their political viewpoint from their faith and based on the Biblical books of Moses. As noted above nothing put forth by the respondent is exclusive to "secular" people as far as political values go. The difference is that Jews and Christians have a belief that their political views, based on their values, ethics and morals, are based on solid accountability to God. Secularists/Humanists/Atheist types of people appear to have their values underpinned by nothing more than the malleable changeable and arbitrary positions on humankind. Judeo-Christians *know* what is right based on the Word of their God. Secular/Humanist types *DECIDE* what they think is right. Jews and Christian believers all *know* that God's Word is unchanging and that Human decisions are EVER changing.
Finally, I'd like someone to explain to me where any mainstream U.S. people of faith have prescribed, recommended or demanded any "theocracy" as a form of Government. Why does faith somehow invalidate the political positions of believers in the eyes of many of the "secular"? If law isn't to be made based on some set of *values*, then what is it to be made based upon? No Christian I know thinks or wants to *force* anyone to Christian belief because that is impossible and the Christian Savior made that clear. Freedom of choice is REQUIRED. That doesn't make it wrong for Christians to seek and work for laws that adhere to their own values and morals. That truth doesn't and shouldn't preclude others from striving for the same thing based on their own beliefs or lack thereof.
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